Will Yousuf Be the 1st?
Mohammad Yousuf might become the first person to represent the "rebel" ICL as well as his national team at the same time.
On the same day that the PCB selectors announced the 15-man squad for the ODIs against the West Indies in Abu Dhabi, a squad that included Yousuf, the news of him joining the ICL was also revealed.
Yousuf is currently in Delhi and he will be launched by the ICL tomorrow in some kind of unveiling ceremony.
It will be intriguing to see how the PCB will react to this.
Yousuf has never been out of Pakistan's ODI and test plans and he was always going to be selected for the upcoming ODI series and he definitely knew this.
Then what brought about this signing with the ICL?
Obviously the still pending case that has stopped him from appearing in either of the two indian 20-20 leagues.
Its an open secret that Inzamam and Moin Khan had been pushing Yousuf for a long time now, and he finally gave in.
So where does this leave his international career?
I believe Yousuf made this move after gaining consent from the PCB administration, especially Ijaz Butt.
Ijaz Butt's comments last week assured that he would be looking after the Pakistani ICL players and it was widely speculated that he would allow them to play domestic cricket in the near future.
Yousuf in all probability will turn up for the ODIs against the West Indies later this month.
I may be wrong but I have a big hunch that this is what is going to happen. And if it does, it will highlight 3 very important points:
1) There is a future for ICL players in Pakistan's cricket structure;
2) The PCB is no longer going to tow the line of the BCCI;
3) The ICL will release players for national duty when required.
The impact of each is quite significant for the times ahead, but I won't get into that right now.
At this moment, lets just hope that Yousuf becomes the first cricketer to appear in the ICL and his national team without announcing his retirement or getting banned.
On the same day that the PCB selectors announced the 15-man squad for the ODIs against the West Indies in Abu Dhabi, a squad that included Yousuf, the news of him joining the ICL was also revealed.
Yousuf is currently in Delhi and he will be launched by the ICL tomorrow in some kind of unveiling ceremony.
It will be intriguing to see how the PCB will react to this.
Yousuf has never been out of Pakistan's ODI and test plans and he was always going to be selected for the upcoming ODI series and he definitely knew this.
Then what brought about this signing with the ICL?
Obviously the still pending case that has stopped him from appearing in either of the two indian 20-20 leagues.
Its an open secret that Inzamam and Moin Khan had been pushing Yousuf for a long time now, and he finally gave in.
So where does this leave his international career?
I believe Yousuf made this move after gaining consent from the PCB administration, especially Ijaz Butt.
Ijaz Butt's comments last week assured that he would be looking after the Pakistani ICL players and it was widely speculated that he would allow them to play domestic cricket in the near future.
Yousuf in all probability will turn up for the ODIs against the West Indies later this month.
I may be wrong but I have a big hunch that this is what is going to happen. And if it does, it will highlight 3 very important points:
1) There is a future for ICL players in Pakistan's cricket structure;
2) The PCB is no longer going to tow the line of the BCCI;
3) The ICL will release players for national duty when required.
The impact of each is quite significant for the times ahead, but I won't get into that right now.
At this moment, lets just hope that Yousuf becomes the first cricketer to appear in the ICL and his national team without announcing his retirement or getting banned.
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if it came to a Lahore Badshahs vs pak team, for whom would yousuf play? guess he'll field for Pak, and bat for LB. Inzi will prevail.
NC
Whosoever will show him more money he will be dancing for that team.
Although I an sympathetic with all the ICL players but I have no sympathy for Yousuf, PCB did every thing to keep him happy during the last administration but there is no end to his greed, he will be willing to sell himself again for the highest bidder any time which is fair but only if past commitments are not dishonored and loyalties are not changed over a few more coins.
apparently PCB was unaware of Yousuf joining the ICL and were not even directly informed by him. It was his wife who called up PCB and told them of his joining; this is said by Zakir Khan who is a top administrator in PCB and he went on to say that Yousuf's case will be dealt with the same yard stick used for other ICL rebel's!
So if this is the case then i dont think Yousuf will be the first person to be playing for his country and the ICL at the same time; but then funny things have happened in Pakistan cricket!
The funny thing is .. Niranjan Shah of BCCI has come forward and claimed that Yousuf was given a sum of 10 million rupees by the IPL and they are in talks with their legal team to take action against Yousuf for violation of a contract....what amuses me is as of now ICL has a stay order against Yousaf playin in the IPL. Now if IPL takes him to court i am guessing Yousuf's ICL career wont take off very soon!!
This all was on GEO NEWS few minutes ago!
Aaqib Javed has been appointed as assistant coach of the Pakistan team, according to a TV channel.
I support Yousuf in this decision. Yousuf's profession is cricket, and he will take steps to ensure he enjoys his profession and makes a living.
For those who question Yousuf's loyalties, I will say two things:
1) He has never said anything bad about Pakistan cricket, nor has he ever lamented representing Pakistan.
2) A lot of us leave our home countries so that we can practice our professions in countries/environments where we have better opportunities, are better compensated, and feel more rewarded. And Yousuf has done just that.
Banning of ICL players is a total failure of the ICC. Just recognize the ICL and life will be fine. Otherwise, continue to play second fiddle to the true world cricket governing body - the BCCI.
Q/Wasim sahab
Yousuf is greedy for sure and in fact many PCB officials have suggested that he has said he will play for whoever pays him the most money.
I have no sympathy with most ICL players except Imran Nazir (only T20 material though) and Shahid Nazir (like Aaqib Javed, Shahid was never a bad bolwer). I also think Hasan Raza is very talented and should have got more opportunities- some of his shots are amazing. He is like a combination of Tendulkar and Inzamam. Hafeez Khalid has impressed me with his keeping and batting, but he was too old to be considered for selection in the Pakistan team ahead of Kamran Akmal.
I suggested that Pakistan cricket's future is without Yousuf and lately I have started perceiving him as only a Test match player. I know his form has been good in ODI's but we have to think of the future. Geoff Lawson was always against the selection of Yousuf because of his lack of fitness and aggressiveness.
The batting order needs to be adjusted, Younis needs to be demoted, Misbah needs to be promoted, Malik should either open or play at no 3 and in the lower middle order guys like Fawad, Mansoor Amjad, Yasir Arafat, Sohail Tanvir should play. You will see an improvement in fielding and bowling and I am sure not much difference will be seen in batting. I can guarantee you 100% if Younis bats at no 5 or 6 you will see his ODI average creeping up in the 40's. Imran Khan's decision to ask him to bat at no 3 was very wrong- and I remember I was the only one on Pakspin who was speaking out against this. Sending Younis at no 3 has lost Pakistan many, many matches.
Sledgehammer:
True Yousuf has never badmouthed Pakistan cricket and nobody is accusing him of that, we all have the right to pursue our career overseas and change employers locally but it has to be done within an ethical and legal limit.
what do you have to say that he took money from PCB and IPL as financial compensation for not playing for ICL and has again changed his mind, he has been contracted by IPL for three years he took $125,000 advance for it against a total sum of Us $ 300,000, and what about playing for his own country, which gave him so much, when he knows that it will be difficult for PCB to allow him to play for ICL,he also knows Pakistan needs him as a test player he still chose to play for IPL and didn't even bothered to inform his employers where are the ethics?
I think greed has imprisoned his soul, he was getting well paid as a PCB employee, PCB did every thing to retain him, this is just black mailing and there is no way it can be justified.
We all change jobs but none of us take money from every corner and in the end work for one employer of our own choice the world doesn't work this way.
I understand ICL is causing problems and thats a different discussion and has nothing to do with honoring one's previous commitments, loyalty, patriotism, and the sense of giving back to you r own country, please don't compare this with a doctor working in Dubai or America, I would treat it like a Pak army officer joining a private militia in India and deserting his own army just before the call of duty.Mohammmad Yousaf has gone AWOL
and he deserves a treatment nothing short of a court marshall.
Yousuf playing for ICL and Pakistan - fantasy cricket.
Wasim's reply reminds me of Cricketfizz's post.
Ottayan:
You are right Scorpy wrote a post not too long ago on him and he also described Yousuf as a greedy individual so we do share the same views on Yousuf.
please don't compare this with a doctor working in Dubai or America, I would treat it like a Pak army officer joining a private militia in India and deserting his own army just before the call of duty.
@wasim: Cricket is a job - just like anything else. Yes there's national pride, but in the world today cricket has become more of a business. To compare it with military desertion is absolutely ludicrous. That is not a job - that is loyalty by near-sacred oath. Cricket is a business contract, just like a job.
We fans get caught up so badly in cricket that we equate it with war, but the players really don't care that much as we think they do. And I understand and respect that. I have hung out with Pakistani and Indian players - they are really good friends, joking, eating, etc. and don't really care about rivalries and all that (there are a few specific exceptions). I'm sure they get caught up as well in passion and glory, but at the end of the day it's mostly a paycheck they are working for.
And if loyalty to a cricket team should be so strong, then it should be a two-way street. Pakistan and the PCB should be embarrassed that Yousuf was denied a visa and yet the team still went to Canada without a whimper. No! That's not the way you do it. You tell the Canadians to figure it out or we don't show up. This is Pakistan's number one player, and one of the world's greatest, but Pakistan/PCB didn't do anything about it? Absolutely pathetic!
For Canada to deny Yousuf a visa, more than likely because of his religious leanings, and for Pakistan to not give a crap, that is insulting to Yousuf and Pakistan. I don't know if that's one of his reasons for leaving, but I think it might be.
(BTW, I am absolutely no fan of Yousuf's conversion to Islam, nor am I a particularly religious person. He could be Jewish, Buddhist, Satan-worshipper, Atheist - whatever, so don't mistake my frustration for a specific religious bias of any sort.)
If PCB had any balls, they would challenge the banning of ICL players. But it's the PCB that is so greedy, short-sighted, and subservient that it will listen to whatever its masters tell it to do. Fetch PCB, fetch!
One last thing - I am not totally aware of the financial dealings between Yousuf-PCB-IPL-ICL. I had not heard about this advance, or this payout. But I will trust you on that. In that sense, yes I agree that if Yousuf did financial misdealings (as opposed to going for a better offer), then that is to be condemned. And yes, he lacked ethics by not telling anyone. But when he's treated like some average joe getting denied a Canadian visa, and PCB not saying a word, then it becomes an ethical pissing contest and the lines start getting a little more blurry.
Cricket has become a business - the sooner we accept that, the better. We can't accept and enjoy IPL and Stanford, and criticize people who go for ICL. Sri Lanka canceled its England test tour in 2009 for IPL - but nary a peep from everyone concerned. And more such actions will follow. Cricket has become more about the money. Whether we agree with the concept or not, that is the reality. Let's not live in denial.
i agree with Wasim,
MoYo will dance to anyone's tune, as long as he is getting the Benjamin's. For someone who wants 50,000 for post match sound bytes, money is the biggest motivator
Sledgehammer:
Cricket is a job and players do engage in business dealings I know that, but when you take money for a job that means you have accepted the offer and you are bound by the agreement as the consideration has been exchanged, it becomes a legally binding contract,Yousuf took money from IPL and PCB, the way he deserted his team just before a tour is not right and cannot be justified under any circumstance.
There is a proper way of switching jobs, one has to fulfill his contractual obligations and give proper notice to his employer and then switch job, in his case he should have announced his retirement from International cricket or should have asked PCB to release him from the contract if it was legally possible, and after fulfilling his contractual obligations with IPL he would have been free to play where ever he wants.
He just ran away like a thief after collecting money from every where.
I think when you opt to play for your country its a little more than just business or any other job, sportsmen all over the world they take pride in serving their country and money always come afterwards, especially in Yousuf's case he was showered with money when he broke VIV Richards record and how did he paid back he deserted the team just before an important tour.
PCB did every thing to satisfy his financial demands they also helped broker a contract with IPL and he earned $125000 without playing a single game he was signed for three years, but no team picked him up because of his legal battle with ICL, and as per rules he got paid by IPL the reserve money on his auction. He is still legally bound to play for IPL after sorting out his legal problems with ICL.
I don't see any problem with a player trying to secure his financial future by negotiating a better deal and by playing for private leagues but I do consider it wrong when a player keeps on collecting money from its employer by using a rebel league as a black mailing tool and leave immediately after all of his demands have been met.That's treachery.
If you won't call it greed and dishonesty then what is it?
Now coming to the Canadian Visa issue, his visa was not turned down,his application was sent very late and there was not enough time to process the application, as initially he was not selected for the T20 tour, Yasir Arafat also couldn't get the visa in time, there is a difference between denying visa and inability to process the visa at a short notice.
His performance in the RBS cup clearly demonstrated his worth as a T20 player and proved the selectors right.
Now coming to the ICL issue that's a different debate and I think the rest of the players have an entirely different case as almost all of them were released by PCB from the central contract before they joined ICL, I completely sympathize with all those players they should be free to earn their livelihood without the fear of any bans and I have always supported the official recognition of ICL.
The game has become commercial and I have no problems about it, but the fans and the players should understand that it doesn't mean that the players will be absolved from fulfilling their contractual obligations and will get a free pass to collect money from every where, if they have become a precious commodity then their buyers once they pay for them own them for the duration of the contract.
I don't think he will be able to play anywhere in the world now including ICL, he will be spending the next few years in different Law offices and court houses and by the time a judgment will be given on his case he will be too old to play cricket.
@wasim: If Yousuf is breaking contractual obligations, then I absolutely 100% agree with you that what he did was wrong (unless he is willing to pay the penalties of breaking the contract - that is his right). As I said, I am not familiar with the financial circumstances so can't really comment on this aspect much. I'm relying on you to be the expert! :)
Now, if PCB showered him with money and all for the most runs in a year, etc. they are just rewarding him for his amazing personal effort. He deserved it - and it's no favor from the PCB. If I get a bonus at my job, it's because I worked for it. But still, all that is moot if he's breaking contracts and expecting to get away with it - there's no excuse for that. You are very right when you say he might spend the rest of his cricketing life in lawyer's offices rather than on the cricket field. Sad, but very possible.
As regards his visa, there is little indication his passport was sent late, and a lot of indication that Canada had some issues with his application - converting to Islam since his last visit to Canada, the beard doesn't help, I'm sure he's affiliated with groups that could be termed as hardline, etc. Whatever the case, any delay by Canadian authorities for one of the greatest cricketers in the world should have been dealt with by PCB in strong terms. And there's no evidence the PCB did anything to help Yousuf. It's really, really embarrassing.
This is not some new kid on the block, this is your most experienced and best player with a long, clean cricketing and personal record. Even admitted druggie Shoaib gets on the first flight out! PCB should have raised hell over Yousuf's visa denial/delay. But perhaps they were more interested in getting to Canada themselves to enjoy the trip, rather than work on Yousuf's case! ;) It's possible that the visa incident has nothing to do with Yousuf's departure, I'm just assuming it does because I definitely would be majorly pissed if it happened to me!
I do agree that there is a more commitment when playing for your country, but it really comes down to money. Even in soccer/football, a lot of players play with more dedication for their clubs rather than for their country. But, there is a certain passion for winning something for your country. I think it is directly proportional to the magnitude of the event. Winning a World Cup or Olympics is a dream. But standard bilateral games with average or sub-standard teams (like Pakistan is doing) is not something one feels very dedicated to. Hence, Yousuf's lack of interest.
Sledgehammer:
The Visa application of Yousuf and Yasir Arafat was sent at the last moment and had nothing to do with religion as Yasir Arafat doesn't support a beard, I know this because canadian embassy clarified this by a statement in Jang and PCB officials also acknowledged the same.
Who's YoMo?
http://boredcricketcrazyindians.blogspot.com/2008/11/whos-moyo.html
Q - that was a BCC! promo, thank you!
Sweet as, Some support for our man Arjuna then.
Well I might have to redo my post on him in this case.
Lets see how things pans out. If the PCB lifts the ICL ban there will be some chatter.
Has Arjuna opened the Pandoras box ???
MoYo or MadSuf (Maddenned Sufferer of the vagaries of a international cricketing career)!
Selfish decision for Youhaana...He is a traitor. he knows after inzy he is the best batsman and only good batsman pak has, yet for money he hopped to ICL.....
but no wonder if he yet again does a u-turn to play back for pak....
After all he is a kaafir :)
Well firstly, now we know that the PCB did not know abt Yousuf signing with the ICL. My hunch was wrong.
Though I still feel that Ijaz Butt will find a way for YOusuf to play for Pakistan in the ODIs against the Windies despite him appearing in the ICL.
NC - if the Lahore Badshahs ever play Pakistan, it will surely be a cracker of a match!
Life in Binary - The PCB called up Yousuf's house and thats when his wife said he's gone to India to play cricket.
As I said I still think Yousuf might be the first.
As for the IPL case - man they shud just drop it.. the ICL and the IPL need to sort out their issues. They're fighting like 2 females after the same boy.
Promote BCC! here as much as u want NC.
Thanks again Q.
MoYo called for a comment here, and a post there.
Wasim, Sledge, Ottayan, Tazeen.. firstly here is Cricket Fizz's post - I argued quite a bit there when it came up:
http://www.cricketfizz.com/cricketblog/absolute-greed-and-mohammed-yousuf
Even though i feel that cricketers should be free to choose and play for whoever pays them more, this time round Yousuf has disgusted quite a few people cos of breaking contracts and jumping without talking to the people concerned.
Here's a post i did a long time back regarding the free economy for cricketers:
http://www.wellpitched.com/2008/02/of-traitors-capitalist-cricket.html
Oh and that canadian visa issue regarding yousuf - i think that was a sad excuse by the PCB for leaving him out of the team and Yousuf probably knows that.
How did they manage to get Shoaib Khan's visa at the last minute?
If they had that much influence they cud have easily managed YOusuf's if they wanted him there.
Yousuf is right in being disgruntled but the manner in which he has jumped is wrong i feel.
@Q: So in two of the three possibilities of the Canadian visa situation, the PCB should be ashamed of itself! Whether Canada denied/delayed his application, or if it was all some excuse to keep him out. Pathetic!
Wasim mentions the third possibility of a delay in sending the application, but I don't buy that one at all, even if "clarifications" were issued.
Yes, Yousuf could have acted in a more responsible manner. But I think people are highly overrating PCB's attitude toward him.
PCB's attitude towards Yousuf has been nothing but pathetic.
You don't treat ur premier batsman like that.
As I said Yousuf has every right to be miffed at them.
And Yousufs canadian visa was applied with everyone else.. its alle xcuses on PCB's part..
Q
Yousuf was already fading as a Test batsman. In 2007 he played 6 Tests and averaged 40.88 which is his worst average since 1999. He reached his peak in 2005 and 2006 but fell very steeply in 2007.
I have nothing against him and if he was eligible to play for Pakistan I would still play him in Tests, but there is no denying his form has deteriorated.
In ODI's he has done much better in 2008, but that is mostly playing against minnows.
Khansahab, Yousuf is Pakistan's best batsman - there is no doubt abt that in my mind.
In 2006 he scored more test runs and hit mort test centuries than any other batsman ever has.
And then the PCB treated him like shit when they dropped him for the 20-20 WC.
U don't do that to ur best batsman.
The whole ICL controversy meant he didn't play the 1st test against SA but turned up in the 2nd.. I think he played a very good knock in the 2nd innings of that test saving the match for Pakistan.
Then the 3 test series against India was an average one... but surely he couldn't hit the peak of 2006 again..
He hasn't played test cricket since then.. 4 average tests does not make a batsman a fading test cricketer...
As for ODIs - minnows or not, he scored more than any other Pakistan batsman did this year...
How how can anyone doubt his status?
Pakistan former Test captain, Rashid Latif has resigned as a Pakistan National and Academy wicket-keeping coach, minute after Saleem Malik accepted National Cricket head coach offer by Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB).
"I am going to resign in protest against appointment of former captain Saleem Malik as chief coach of National Academy," Latif told Cricdb.
Rashid Latif was the one who had raised the issue regarding match fixing against Saleem Malik, and helped Justice Malik Qayyum in his judicial inquiry against particular players for their involvement in match-fixing and several allegations of corruption dating back to 1994.
Latif during Qayyum’s inquiry recorded his statements against his former teammate. “Before the fifth ODI at Christchurch, he was called by Salim Malik to his room and offered 10 Lacs to throw away the match,” Latif had said. “There were five other cricketers present in the room. However, he refused to take up the offer,” he added.
Q
We all love to pick on PCB, but the fact in this case is that it's all Yousuf's fault, it's his greed which is causing all the problems, how did PCB mistreated him, have you watched his matches in RBS T20,he should also make a realistic self assessment the selectors were not wrong on dropping him, he was compensated financially so what is he gripping about, he made a huge blunder now pretty soon he will find himself nowhere, he won't be able to play for ICL/IPL and if he signed another contract with ICL he will not play for Pakistan.
As far as rough treatment is concerned, we all love to hate Shoaib Akhtar nobody got more worse treatment than Shoaib Akhtar from PCB some he deserved and some was an over reaction from PCB, Hats off to him he never considered to play for ICL always said that playing for his country is his first priority.
We can continue to pick on PCB in this case like always but the biggest culprit is Yousuf himself, believe it or not whether Yousuf was included in the Pak T20 team or not he would have still gone for ICL for one reason or another.
Wasim, I completely disagree.
I will come back to Yousuf, but let me address shoaib akhtar first.
How exactly do u think he got rough treatment from the PCB?
Shoaib had has discipline problems since he started playing for Pakistan. The PCB has put up weith him through everything - injuries after every 2nd match, late night drinking, doping, hitting team mates with bats, etc.. the list is endless.
Despite all this the PCB spent millions on him through personal trainers, getting fit regimes and what not..
PCB had always backed Shoaib and the only time where a harsh penatly was imposed on him was earlier this year but even that got reversed.
Shoaib has gotten away with everything and the PCB has backed him throughout. So where is the rough treatment?
Coming back to Yousuf.
He ended 06 as the best batsman Pakistan had...
6 months later PCB dropped him from the world 20-20 squad. Why? They had not seen his performance in 20-20 cricket till then.. they just thought he won't be good enough.. how could they without even trying.. hence the ICL.
PCB fucked up.
NAsim Ashraf then realised that Pakistans batting would be nothing without him so he got him an IPL contract and convinced him to leave the ICL. We don't know if the IPL paid him more than the ICL or not. We have no such figures. But Yousuf, being massaged by the PCB, decided to listen.
He played a couple of tests and then in 2008 he was the best ODI batsman for Pakistan... then comes the Canada tournament and PCB talk about visa issues.
Why would Yousuf not be disgruntled?
PCB could get Shoaib Khan's visa at the last minute on short notice when he wasnt even in the original squad but they couldnt get one for Yousuf? What a load of bull!
PCB fucked up again.
You don't treat your premier batsman like this.
Q
Except for Drugs Shoaib hasn't done anything extra which other bowlers or star players before him haven't done, who in the world will get dropped and fined Rs 7 mil for just criticizing a pitch you call it fair think again! Imran Khan during his whole career criticized domestic structure and PCB did he ever got punished? if we kick him in and out of the team so much for petty reasons how can we expect him to remain in form.
We all know the character of the other player/players involved in the hitting incident so we can never say who was at fault or who instigated the incident.Such incidents happened before but never came out of the dressing room and nobody ever got such a big punishment look at Harbhajan/ Sreeshant incident and compare their punishment with Shoaib's then you will realize what I am talking about.
I agree with you PCB fucked up big time in handling Shoaib!
When we compare his achievements with Wasim, Imran and Waqar we also forget that during those days we had a fast bowler as a captain, the pitches were mostly supporting, how many matches you have seen Shoaib playing under Inzi/Malik in which the wicket was even slightly helpful for the fast bowlers?
Anyways this post was for Yousuf, we will discuss Shoaib at some other time.
I do not agree at all with you on Yousuf, you have very conveniently forgotten and failed to mention in your response where Yousuf fucked UP!
Nobody is denying his class as a test/ODI batsman, but on the same token all the cricket pundits acknowledge the fact that he is a complete liability as a fielder, he takes too much time to get settled and his several domestic T/20 performances strongly suggest that he is not suitable for the T20 game a fact with which he is not coming to terms with as a reference you can take a look at his performance in RBS cup, Kallis was also dropped from T20 WC, Dravid,Laxman and Ganguly were also not selected for T/20 WC none of these players blackmailed their respective boards , PCB was very generous to him during 2006 and also did every thing to help him out in recouping the financial loss for rejecting ICL.His personal statements thanking Nasim Ashraf and stating that he made a mistake by accepting ICL offer is evident of the fact that at that time he was content with what he got.
He fucked up his T/20 career himself, if he had not joined ICL out of greed or haste he would have been picked up by any IPL team, but he still got US $350000 guarantee money contract from IPl thats the exact amount of his contract and Us $ 125,000 have already been paid to him as advance his contract is for three years, wasn't he aware of the terms and conditions before accepting the money? Or he intends to play stupid again!
He has committed a breach of contract with three parties on three different occasions I am surprised that it doesn't tell you anything about his character, I also don't understand why are you defending his dishonesty and greed and blaming it all on PCB.
If Canadian Embassy releases an official statement that there was not enough time to process his and Yasir's application then there is nothing much left for arguing, also you and me are not aware of why his and Yasir Arafat's application was not completed on time and was submitted a little later than the rest, what were the factors behind the delay? we can only speculate, maybe it was because these two didn't filled up or signed the documents on time or didn't submitted their passports on time, maybe it was because PCB really didn't wanted him to Play in T20. Who knows?
He has completely fucked up his career, his signing with ICL again clearly reflects his ignorance about contractual obligations and the consequences of a breach of contract.
Now even if we take PCB out of the equation either ICL or IPL will be suing him for a breach of contract and as a result he will not be able to play for any league, don't tell me he wasn't aware of all this,and if he signs the new agreement with ICL he will not be playing for Pakistan.
In all fairness he has created all this mess and is solely responsible for it.
You know my views about ICL and monopolistic attitude of BCCI/IPL but thats a different discussion.
Also what about Yousuf's fitness? if he spends more time in practicing than Tabligh I'm sure he would be much more fitter.
Shoaib was never involved in any betting incident which is a much more bigger crime than any of Shoaib's crimes, PCB turned a blind eye toward what Wasim, waqar, Saleem and Inzi did for a long time and you still think that he received a fair treatment.
Its true we don't know which league paid him more, but he expressed his satisfaction earlier that his loss was compensated, we also don't know the amount of his fresh ICL contract which made him change his mind once again.
In my opinion, bending backwards for this guy is just not worth it, for someone who puts his needs in front of the country.
As far as some of the comments on bending for the BCCI goes, I do not think that the relationship between the asian boards have been that of a master and slave, even though the BCCI has dominated on the leadership aspect. The relationship between the BCCI and non-asian boards are clearly that of a tussle between master-slave supremacy.
We have basically looked after each ones backside for almost 2 decades now and that is the reason why we are all still here talking about out teams and what not's. period.
The relationship between the asian boards have always been give and take.
If the mood now is to take the bait of the ECB and align with them, then good luck, like in the past, when the first sign of trouble comes, they will be the first to break Bolt's record running away.
There won't be much cricket happening in Asia that's for sure.
Q/Wasim sahab
Whatever the character of Afridi or Mohammad Asif is like, the fact is it was Shoaib who committed the act of hitting Asif.
If Afridi or Asif had provoked Akhtar by hitting him first, only then would his retaliatory act be justified. But if they were just joking with him or even if they were daring him or verbally provoking him, I don't see how this completely uncivilised act can be justified.
Wasim, I understand your view point regarding Yousuf breaching contracts and jumping parties on more than one occasion but the reason I defend him is because I am sure there is more to it than what meets the eye.
My 1st issue is the fact that the ICL players have been mishandled by the PCB.
Secondly I feel that Yousuf was ill treated by the PCB. Being the premier batsman he should have been treated better.
Thirdly, Inzamam on GEO the other day talked about Yousuf and other senior players complaining about how they have had no respect given to them from the board or the team management, i.e. Malik and Lawson - this is very true.
The reason I say that Yousuf is not wrong is because all this talk about breaching contracts and jumping for more money, etc etc is not right IMO cos Yousuf has knowingly done everything. He is not naive or stupid to act in this manner. He has valid reasons to do so.. and he is aware of the consequences.
In his first press conference after joining the ICL, Yousuf said:
"See, I want to continue playing for Pakistan and the ICL authorities also have no problem with that,"
The ball in my view is in the PCB's hands here!
Khansahab, I agree it was Shoaib who raised the bat. And we do know that Afridi was trying to tell Shoaib to discipline himself and Asif joined in, hence Shoaib's anger.
U c Wasim the 5 year ban and fine slapped on Shoaib was not because he criticized the PCB and the domestic structure.
The issue was that after the bat hitting incident, shoaib was put on probation for a 2 year period - 1 more offence and he would be banned for life. He knew that.
That probation came about due to the past problems as well as the bat hit.
Criticizing the PCB is an offence according to the PCB rules and regulations... Kaneria did that too and he got a fine.. the reason shoaib got a ban was because he was on probation.
Drugs is the only publicised wrong that Shoaib has done. What about all that he does which does not get published? Im sure u hear abt that from friends like I do..
Scorps, you make a valid point. Historically the Asian boards have looked out for each other. there are a number of examples.. but of late the BCCI has been playing the big daddy... and the other Asian boards realise this.
Unfortunately I have been away from this site for a while.
Mohammad Yousuf, or Yousuf Youhana call him what you will has now been banned from representing Pakistan.
He has signed with the ICL. After constant mistreatment by the PCB he chose himself over country or opted to change his job than work for a shitty employer.
Cricketers have feelings as well, and if not treated properly they have all the reason to completely and adequately jump ship.
Farewell Yousuf, you will be missed.
Q
I agree with you on the point that PCB should have not banned its players taking part in ICL.But under current circumstances when none of the non Asian boards are sending their team to Pakistan, PCB cannot afford to strain its relations with BCCI that is the tough reality all the players fully understand this situation. But sadly most of them opted for the rebel league for financial benefits, there isn't much PCB can do in this situation.
I do not agree that Yousuf was mishandled in fact he was the only player about whom PCB made any effort so that he doesn't join ICL we all know about it.
Now from what I understand you are trying to say that Yousuf should have been given an automatic selection in T20 format.
Well I will again refer to his performance in the RBS T20 and his fielding standards and his slow batting in all fairness the selectors were right.
18 Pakistani players have joined ICL and almost all of them joined because they were not selected in the Pakistan team are you saying that all of them or majority of them deserved automatic selection in Pakistan team.If not then I don't think PCB had much of a choice.
The only reason I am against Yousuf's decision to join ICL is because he has made the most money from PCB in the last two years he should have been content financially.
Inzamam has no credibility left, obviously he had to shift blame on somebody otherwise him and Moin would have come under direct attack for luring Pakistan players to the rebel league.
I am no longer a fan of Malik's captaincy and has never been a fan of Lawson, but this accusation that he is disrespecting senior players like Yousuf, Younis and Afridi is just a lame excuse.
In fact none of these players have supported him as a captain by their performance or otherwise in fact each and every one of them has openly expressed their aspiration to become the captain so their grudge is quite obvious.Each one of these players underperformed in key matches during the past 15 months and performed when it didn't mattered or their place was in Jeopardy.
The decision to appoint Malik as a captain was a wrong one but I don't think DNA had any other choice when Younis who was the leading candidate refused the job twice. I know you will say "Afridi" but IMO he doesn't deserve to be in the team most of the times because of his indifferent form and his performance in key matches.
But if the team's unity is at stake then I think PCB should consider him seriously in January.
Nothing will change even then as the sad part is that these players have inflated egos and are rogue by nature, PCB did every thing to control player power but these players have found in ICL a perfect way to retaliate.ICL is providing them with a leverage to bring PCB on its knees.Ultimately PCB will have to do something about this issue otherwise next year ICL will feature two teams from Pakistan.
Q
Afridi wasn't saying Shoaib to discipline himself in fact he was pumping Asif to tease and ridicule Shoaib, Asif was comparing Shoaib with a "KHOTI" and was ridiculing him with his cheap jokes and Afridi was boosting him, I understand that raising a bat was an uncivilized act but he wasn't the one who started it, and that incident had nothing to do with cricket or on field behavior, I still believe that Shoaib wasn't treated fairly in that incident and the chief culprits escaped punishment.And very conveniently became victims.
I am not saying Shoaib is free of any problems but over the years he has become an easy target. The board and media pick on him too often where others who do the same things remain completely unnoticed.
Q
Afridi wasn't saying Shoaib to discipline himself in fact he was pumping Asif to tease and ridicule Shoaib, Asif was comparing Shoaib with a "KHOTI" and was ridiculing him with his cheap jokes and Afridi was boosting him, I understand that raising a bat was an uncivilized act but he wasn't the one who started it, and that incident had nothing to do with cricket or on field behavior, I still believe that Shoaib wasn't treated fairly in that incident and the chief culprits escaped punishment.And very conveniently became victims.
I am not saying Shoaib is free of any problems but over the years he has become an easy target. The board and media pick on him too often where others who do the same things remain completely unnoticed.
I think more than drugs or unrowdy behaviour, Shoaib's biggest problem is his weight.
How can you excuse that? How can the world's fastest bowler also be the most overweight one?
Because of his weight he puts too much strain on this limbs, foot, shoulder etc- everywhere and no wonder he cannot bowl after 3-4 overs. He has been intermittently overweight but is being seen too often nowadays. I can remember him being overweight as far as year 2000.
What a waste....
Q, in what way big daddy... I can't understand that or have there been some reports you know since I may have missed.
Let me know
cheers
Q not G> I guess your question has been answered now that Moyo has been banned.
Shame really. But whats he doing signing up with ICL in the first place ? Its a big loss to cricket as well as Pakistan imo.
Damith, it is a big loss. His signing with the ICL has a lot to do with the politics in Pakistan cricket. If you read the discussion on these comments, u will get a sense of wats going on.
In brief though, yousuf has said that he is willing to play for PAkistan despite signing with the ICL. So the ball really is in the PCB's court.
Scorps, the fact that BCCI controls more than 70% of the revenues made from cricket makes them the big daddy doesn't it?
Today if u do not play against India, u don't make money. If u don't play in India, u don't make money.
If you don't listen to India, u don't make money.
BCCI rules the roost my friend and there's nothing wrong with it!
Khansahab, Shoaib's major problem is the heroin / cocaine. He has abused his body no end. The fact that he can still run in and bowl that fast despite abusing his body is quite an achievement. The weight problem is compounded by his drinking and doing drugs..
Wasim our arguement abt Yousuf and Shoaib and Afridi are never ending discussions, which i think can be more conclusive only if done in person ;-)... lets just agree to disagree right now..
Q
Cocaine and Heroin! I hope you know that these drugs are banned substances and if he was using these drugs they would have been screened in his blood by now in the countless drug tests he gave. Nobody can bowl 150MPH if he abuses heroin either you were misinformed or its just your imagination. This was exactly my point how unfair we have been to Shoaib we keep on accusing him and blow things out of proportion.
Q
Yousuf's statement that he is still willing to play for Pakistan and the ball is in PCB's court clarifies everything.
So far he was trying to give us the impression by his statements that he joined ICL as a reaction to PCB's policies and Malik's rough treatment,Now that he has made more money in ICL have those policies changed? Isn't it the same PCB and Malik? Why he is ready again to play for the country, didn't he deserted the same team just before an important tour, now that he has made the extra money he was dying for he wants his international career back, or atleast by making such statements against PCB and Malik he will do some damage control about his image in Pakistan.
He is a sick person with no integrity.
I will end this discussion over here, and will agree to disagree.
No Wasim, neither am I misinformed, nor am I using my imagination. Heroin, cocaine, and hash are rampant amongst the pakistan cricketers and these are not banned substances as they are entertainment drugs and not performance enhancing drugs.
I have seen shoaib and a number of other pak players abuse their bodies with my own eyes, hence I'm sure about what I'm saying.
Q
Here's the link to the 2008 list of banned substanes by wada go on page 9 of the pdf and you will see heroin/cocain/hash all of them are prohibited.
http://www.wada-ama.org/rtecontent/document/2008_List_En.pdf
No bowler can bowl 150 Mph if he takes heroin/ cocain
Hash is the most ancient performance enhancer/ muscle relaxant/ pain relieving drug.The use of this can be traced back to the Roman Era where athletes and Day laborers used it.
Dude... ok the money yeah they are big daddy indeed... but you said of late they are playing so etc., so I wondered if something new has come up after the fiasco with SL board.
Cheers
Wasim, I don't know what to make of that list... I'm sure there must be some way to mask the traces of substances such as hash and coke because as I said, it is rampant among the Paki cricketers
Scorps, as for playing - I think they have more recently started to excercise the power they have due to being the big daddy than ever before...
Again, there's nothing rong with that. They can so they should.
he will be the first.........Sad he puts money before country.......
visit my new post on two legands of cricket at
http://christopherdavid007.blogspot.com/2008/11/legendary-farewell-for-two-legends.html
looking forward for your thoughts.